cross-posted from: https://lemmy.world/post/49514337
Their compatibility list notes 75.33% are Playable, 22.93% can go in-game but not be finished and only 1.69% can’t get past the intro.
That’s impressive.
At my work, we had these cell processor-based blade servers for a while. Basically the same chips as in a PS3 except they could handle double-precision floats. We wanted to use them for scientific modelling, but gave up eventually. They were such a bitch to program! I can only imagine emulating them must’ve been a nightmare.
Whoa what do you do? That sounds super fascinating!
It’s a small company that does mineral surveying, but we’ve done a lot of R&D in the past that ranged from designing our own survey instrumentation to writing geophysical modelling software. The Cell thing was for the latter.
IIRC the Cell processor was built around an IBM PowerPC, but that wasn’t meant to do all the heavy lifting. Rather, it was supposed to be farmed out to these other processing nodes (I forget what they were called), almost like using a GPU for general computation. Now, the IBM consultant sold us on the Cell, saying they had an OpenCL library that would make all this much easier and hide the hardware details. LOL!
First of all, it was a 32-bit library. Maybe fine for a 32-bit console like the PS3, but our blades had 16 GB of RAM and it wasn’t going to cut it. So I had to dig into the guts of the architecture to get anything usable and, long story short, a summer went by and I had little to show for my efforts.
Years later, we eventually got the program running on Threadrippers and that worked out much better!
Yeah, I suspect most game developers felt the same way about it.
Most PS3 ports were rubbish compared to the Xbox 360 versions, despite the PS3 theoretically being better hardware.
Only the fancier PS3 exclusives really made the most of it.
Cool, thank you satisfying my curiosity! Wouldn’t have thought of mineral surveying crossed with tech, though not surprising eh, not something I come across personally I guess.
Since we’re already drifting off topic - all big tech companies make a lot of money by selling hardware, compute, or some other service to the oil and gas industry, they just don’t go out bragging about it. Before the AI boom the oil and gas industry was among the biggest customers of the tech industry, just a quick search gives:
https://www.amd.com/en/solutions/energy.html
https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/ai/energy-resources/oil-gas
https://www.nvidia.com/en-us/industries/energy/oil-gas-operations/
https://cloud.google.com/solutions/energy/oil-gas
Yeah, the prospecting industry includes mining and oil/gas. I’m in the former. In the past, if you went to a trade convention, the oil/gas side would take up at least 2/3 of the floor space, but that’s kind of flipping around now. The electrification of the economy is bringing metals to the fore.
Well I’m in Canada, and almost everything is tied in with natural resources at some level. Lol
What was the justification to buy them in the first place?
I guess you could say the Cell was as an 8-core CPU (well, 9, if you include the PowerPC in the middle) at a time when such things were unheard of, at least in the consumer space. So the theoretical performance if you could max out all those cores was through the roof. I have no doubt that’s what drew Sony to them for their next gen console.
But whereas all the cores of a modern 8-core chip can access the same RAM, in the Cell, only the PowerPC could access the main memory and each core had its own dedicated internal RAM, meaning you had to load both code and data into all the cores laboriously yourself using asynchronous DMA requests before executing the code, and then sync the results back using more DMA. It was a bit like GPU programming, I suppose, though within the cores, it felt more like a CPU in terms of the instruction set and what not, so kind of a hybrid approach I guess?
That sounds like something that might have made it easier to emulate, since on x64 the memory management could be simplified. Though that kind of cache control can lead to very high performance if the working set of data fits into that cache that x64 might have trouble keeping up with.
Yeah, you know, that’s a good way of looking at it. It’s like each core could only access its own cache memory, and all the syncing to main RAM had to be done painstakingly in software. That would be a hardware function in any modern architecture. I can’t remember how big the caches were. I think they were bigger than a typical L1 at least, but not huge.
Anyway, it was not too horrible if you were just walking through an array sequentially applying some operation to it, but when you had to jump around memory, it became an absolute nightmare! Uuuugh…it’s all coming back to me now why we got nowhere with it.
That central core must have gotten really busy managing the memory if several cores were each jumping around a lot. Did it have to do other things also or was it just fulfilling memory requests?
Oh yeah! I mean to be fair, it was a full-fledged PowerPC single core in its own right. I’m pretty sure that generation had AltiVec (simd instructions), so you could theoretically do some number-crunching on it as well, but it had plenty to do already with managing memory I/O. And actually also network I/O for us, since I worked a bit on trying to combine the resources of more than one blade. But man, it just devolved into a giant mess in the end! I think I still have some PTSD from it :P
Were you generating dynamic instructions based on what the cores were doing or was it all statically programmed such that the PowerPC core had to be running very specific code that went along with the specific code running on each worker core?
That first one might have been very scalable, though I have a feeling either one would be a nightmare to actually write and hell to debug.
Fascinating insight.
It was a bit like GPU programming,
Don’t remember where I’ve read this but supposedly SONY wanted it to be part of their geometry engine, but ultimately had to cut down the costs and use Nvidia GPU instead. So maybe that analogy isn’t that far off
Maybe I don’t need to bother fixing my PS3.
Do it anyway for the skillgain, the e-waste prevention, and bragging rights. 🤙
I only have one because I always wanted to have all 7th gen consoles back in the day but could only have one.
The fat PS3 was a great deal because it could run Linux and natively play PS2 games as well. I haven’t been into consoles since the fat PS3, they have all gotten worse and worse IMO. I did buy a Steam Deck and really like it, if that counts as a console.
Unfortunately not all the fats could run PS2 games, only the CECHAxx and CECHBxx (NTSC) had the hardware to run PS2 games. The early PAL models (CECHCxx and CECHExx) had software emulation apparently, dunno if it was any good. I hunted down a fat model specifically because I wanted the backwards compatibility, can’t remember which model I ended up buying, but it was not a backwards compatible one. Very disappointed at the time, but I was still sad when it died.
Also the possiblity to dualboot Linux was patched out pretty quickly if I remember correctly, people were pretty peeved about it.
Hmm I wonder if mine is that old. I got it used from a friend that also got it used back in the day. I never even tried sticking one of my PS2 games in it.
If it has a shitton of ports in the front, USB and SD card and all sorts of stuff, there’s a good chance. If it only has 2 USB ports, probably not.
Doh, no such luck for me. Oh well, I still have my PS2 lol.
They play PS2 games just fine, all PS3 models do. It’s something like 7% of games in the entire library that have issues with the software emulator but the vast majority of games will run and play without any problems.
The hardware backwards compatibility makes it slightly easier to use physical discs, that’s about it. It also doesn’t play every game perfectly like the original console, but it is slightly better than software.
They play PS2 games just fine, all PS3 models do.
Noooo… that’s not right at all. If we are talking unmodified hardware. The original models did have something like 99% compatibility, but as the generation moved on, the fat models removed more components to make it cheaper and made PS2 backward compatibility more software driven… until the slim models removed PS2 disc reading completely.
We used to look at the hard drive size to gauge. 20GB & 60GB was full hardware, 80GB was partial software, anything above was a slim and had no PS2 abilities.
PS1 muddies the water because all PS3s can play PS1 game discs.
This used to confuse so many people because I swapped the hard drive for a 120 gig SSD. So I then had a 120 gig “60 gig” PS3. “the slim model?” No, the fat one “But then what model had…?” Yeah it was a pain to explain to some people what exactly it was.
The power supply on my fat PS3 recently quit on me. It feels like the old YLOD but happens the moment the power supply kicks in instead of taking 10 seconds or so. Fingers crossed I can find a doner supply, it’ll be a while before I get to it though.
Fingers crossed I can find a doner supply 🥙😋
Oh my Lord… I think you just predicted dinner!
I’d like to think the Steam Deck is a PC that is changing the rules as to what form factor a “personal computer” can take - of course with a heavy focus on gaming and so it takes a lot of design inspiration from what console gaming got right.
Console used to mean “specialized hardware to be able to push pixels needed for an incredible gaming experience” but now it means “locked down PC with walled garden ecosystem and advertising built in, including tracking”
I do have to give Sony credit for trying to improve audio in games with the PS5’s audio system - but has it worked? Have any games blown anyone away with their immersive sound design?
The only other “killer” feature of the PS5 was direct texture loading onto VRAM (bypassing CPU), and I think PCs can do that now with DirectStorage. So what is the point of a console anymore?
Sony knows this and they’re out of ideas. This is why they are locking down their ecosystem. I mean, it probably won’t work well for them, least not in the long term.
Newer traditional consoles are going that route anyways, too. Price aside, the Steam Machine is just a prebuilt PC masquerading as a console, and the next Xbox is rumored to be following that same approach.
Whatever Sony is doing, though…your guess is as good as mine. I don’t even know if Sony knows what Sony is doing at this point.
The PS5s audio system is nothing special, what are you talking about? You didn’t buy into all the “tempest is their secret sauce and can be used for extra graphics work” BS did you?
I got a slim
7th gen specifically? Any reason why?
What I grew up with. Nostalgia is a helluva drug.
Totally fair!
I was asking about my ps3 and its shitty performance at a retro games store and they had an electronics repair guy that said it probably just needed to be repasted/thermal pads replaced, and quoted $90 for doing it. Makes me want to get into that myself because I already had mine open to clean dust out and though it was kinda stressful, it was also fun and rewarding, and the stress generally comes from the uncertainty.
I’ve done this and once you know the procedure it’s easy money. You can even sell up for ‘premium’ thermal compound and full dust removal.
Yeah, that’s what I was thinking. I’ve fixed a bunch of electronics myself over the years, from rebending the metal in my logitech G7 when the click stopped behaving right to replacing the switch outright on my G900 when it started doing the same thing, to fixing the stick drift on my PSVR2 controller after I accidentally threw it across the room, to fixing a strummer that would stick on a 3rd party guitar controller. Each of those was a bit different but all pretty straightforward and saved me a bunch of money.
The part that makes me hesitate is that each of those were done at my own risk. I had to retire the G7 after one attempt to fix the button resulted in dropping the tiny plastic part on carpet, losing it forever. That was fine because it was mine and like the 3rd or 4th time I fixed it. But if I’m doing it for someone else, then I won’t necessarily be able to just write it off as a loss if something breaks in the process. I might start out by buying broken items cheap, fixing them and selling them so the risk (and decisions about rasolution) is still all just on me. Or maybe letting people bet against me as an insurance. Like pay an extra $5 or something and if I break it, I’ll pay you $150.
I’m in a similar boat, though my current GPU (1050Ti) probably isn’t up to much beyond lighter/2D titles (due to overhead) and those files are a bit heavy/messy to manage.
I actually have 2 PS3s (my YLoD original w/drive donated to other, a slightly newer model that might have dry paste). Would be nice if I had someone to help with this (my OG has stuff on it*), then again I could do some of it myself I just am not bothering to do so. I did play through a few of my old games as-is on the newer PS3.
* including LBP1 water DLC that was discontinued and wasn’t included w/GotYE. Though due to storage constraints and lack of planning it’s very possible there’s media I purchased that I deleted at some point
Unfortunately the InFamous games are still just “in-game”.
Sucker Punch really optimised for the weird architecture, especially inFamous 2, one of the more impressive PS3 games I think
They’re both beatable, only issue is poor performance and glitchy graphics on Cole’s face at high resolutions.
I should build an emulation machine out of spare parts…
I wish Infamous 2 didn’t require a NASA computer to run well.
That franchise was really ahead of its time… Graphics, mechanics, everything…
And PoP!
Finished infamous 2 again earlier this year: it really is a gem!
Might want to get into this. Would this emulator allow me to play off disks in my Blu-ray drive? Or will I need to find/make disk images?
Would this emulator allow me to play off disks in my Blu-ray drive?
Signs point to no, at least due to DRM (?) many PC blu-ray drives aren’t capable of reading PS3 discs. Technically possible if you buy a specific drive (or maybe altering a drive?), otherwise you probably would need a PS3 with custom firmware to rip your own games.
EDIT, More directly:
In its current state, RPCS3 does not support reading game data directly from PlayStation 3 format discs.
You’ll need to rip and decrypt.
But is Demons Souls one of them?
Yep! Not only that but there is working multiplayer too!
Yep like the other said it works. I played it about a year ago on RPCS3 on both Mac and Windows 10. Got up to the Old King Alliant boss fight and got stuck again… then started playing Bloodborne on my PC instead with ShadPS4
…I was not aware Bloodborne had been emulated. I’ve never gotten to play it as I refuse to buy a console for just one game.
Awesome!
Yes it’s pretty fun. The emulated version has some glitches but I found I could get rid of most of the graphical issues just by having my character wear a helmet or mask that would completely cover the face model. Basically the most glitches came from the character model’s face or eyes. I wrote a guide on how to set it up awhile back, mostly cobbled together from other people’s work online.
https://lemmy.world/post/25272169
Note that ShadPS4 was updated to prevent installing games the way I did, after I wrote that guide. To make that work you may have to install an old version of the emulator first and after installing your games you can update the emulator.
Yep, just played It last week.
Yes, it is listed as playable !
Hopefully the Bluepoint remaster can be made playable on PC someday, too. I’ll never forgive Sony for killing it and closing the studio down.
glad to see Tokyo Jungle on there! hopefully someday I can find a rip
Oh I loved Tokyo Jungle! What a fun and delightful game. Iirc you started off as a Pomeranian and worked your way up to bigger and badder animals right?
Pomeranian for the carnivores and a deer for the herbivores if I remember correctly
Just saying for most of these games emulation is probably pointless if game has PC port.
They should focus on exclusives and games with lacking PC port.
They don’t work so you can play (pirated) games, they work because building a near-complete emulator is demanding and satisfying work.
This is really impressive, but it’s also a bit of a shame about the timing since so many great games from PS3 were already ported to PC, like Bloodborne, RDR, Last of Us or Uncharted
When was Bloodborne ported to PC?
Or on the PS3 for that matter?
Oh shit, you’re right
Only Uncharted 4 is available on PC, none of the PS3 era games are available, sadly. I haven’t tried on the most recent version of the emulator, but:
- Uncharted 1, 2: Completed all the way through
- Uncharted 3: Got to the final level, but couldn’t complete it. It also crashed a LOT, and there are several janky spots with crazy slow downs etc. like the ship graveyard. It’s also a bit annoying to get running in the first place. The recommended settings are actually required in my experience. Doesn’t work without them.
I love me some Uncharted! Emulator is going to be the best way to play them soon. It’s already superior imo because I was able to set up gyro aim
edit: I’m misremembering the games. It was 3 that I couldn’t complete due to the demon hallucination things causing a crash, not 2
